Jordan’s GDP per capita was estimated at $4,700, and it has a population of nearly 6 million. Descendents of Palestinian refugees from Israel and West Bank outnumber the “original” Jordanians. 92% of the population is Sunni Muslim. Greek Orthodoxy and other Christian religions make up another 6%, with 2% consisting of small Shi’a Muslim and Druze populations. Although Jordan is having difficulty in the area of economic development, its general lack of internal violence and the justness of its legal system relative to other Middle Eastern countries give it a solid possibility of improvement. The government is working to build its health and pharmaceutical industries in order to further economicdevelopment, and leaders have been working tirelessly to secure new investors. King Abdullah has taken theappropriate preliminary steps for economic reform by joining the World Trade Organization in 2000 and beginning participation in the European Free Trade Association in 2001, and if he is able to speed up the pace of his plans, Jordan may well be able to conquer its economic difficulties.
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Jordanians are not a failed people. As a matter of fact, wherever Jordanians go outside of Jordan they thrive culturally, professionally, and economically.
As soon as they enter into the domain of the state + regime, 1 out of 3 becomes poor, unemployed, and hopeless. The other two either succeeded outside of Jordan, or are direct beneficiaries of the politics of repression and targeted-taxation (similar to targeted assassinations)
Each Jordanian has an independence day. It's the day he escapes the grip of repression.
So Jordan the country and Jordanians the people are NOT failures. The only reason Jordan is not like Taiwan, Malaysia, or Singapore, is because of the runaway regime corruption.
I can't believe you are quoting a neo-con publication. This is one of the most politicized "journals" in the US. Hardly a source to be quoted unless you are AIPAC or The New Republic.
Never forget the massive investment the neo-cons put into "moderate" regimes. The last thing they wish to do is to pee on their own cake.
Lets look at the list closely. Syria is a failed state? how? They enjoy the same iron-fist "stability" we enjoy. Egypt a failed state? how? Everything you can say about Syria and Egypt applies to the Jordanian regime, at least based on HRW and AI.
This reports flatters those with unconditional support for US policies in the region. Egypts is guilty of not being 100% stooge of the US and Israel. Syria is guilty of being a supporter of resistance groups in Iraq, Lebanon, and Palestine.
So before you celebrate the report, make sure the readers agree the source has any credibility what so ever.
from Jordan
said:Batir, i wonder why many people defend foreign publications and reports when they are negative, and the same attack the reports and rankings which have positive aspects toward Jordan...
We know in Jordan there's corruption (the article itself says that) I condemn corruption, but i personally found it inappropriate to discuss this issue in such demagogic method as Kafer does.. Targeted assassinations, personal independence day ... I'm sure you can express your points of view without saying such things ;)
The situation is better than Syria when the whole police institution can be corrupted by a few dozen packets of cigarettes.. but you know the "iron-fist stability" is defended by 97% democratically-elected president :)
from Jordan
said:Alessandra, you are welcomed at any time.
Kafer; I might agree with you provided that you can accept the difference between our neighbors and those of Malaysia and Singapore.
Rabani; Foreign Policy is not a neo-con publication and if you follow the publication exactly you will see a lot of concerted anti-conservative literature. You can see that Egypt and Pakistan were considered as failed states and tehy got more "investment" than Jordan which proves that your point is not valid.
Syria is a failed state because its people are living in poverty and repression while the country is rich with resources and that can hardly be the case in Jordan.
I do not need the consensus of all the readers to my sources since this wil never happen. I choose mine, and you have the right to object.
Yogi your question is really good. I remember when some visitors of this blog where giving unconditional support for Israeli newspapers when they write something negative about Jordan.
from United States
said:I just wonder if jordan never recieve US Aid,will you be able to post this Index??http://www.jordanembassyus.org/05102005004.htm
from Jordan
said:Al Urduni, ever wondered what the index will be if Jordan did have some oil and water to make it in no need for US assisstance? Yes, it is a very hypothetical assumption, just like yours!
Batir, the investment thing is related to the market and resources, egypt for example provides a big consumer market compared to jordan-we are 6 million, they are 75 million, they have gas-water we don't so it is not fair to compare us to egypt or pakistan or even syria..Without the US aid I think by now we should have been competing with iraq and sudan, not to forget the saudi "aid"- but If you want to be more accurate I would define this "aid" as wages for our services and we are way underpaid, our contributions in fighting "terrorism" are priceless..
Urduni, I think that countries tend to buy influence, and don't forget that even england couldn't stand up against money power when it came to the "Yamama deal" so I think it is not fair to blame jordan, we try to do our best in surviving..
But again batir, jordan can be the next singapore if there was enough will..
"i wonder why many people defend foreign publications and reports when they are negative, and the same attack the reports and rankings which have positive aspects toward Jordan..."
This is your flawed reading of the situation. As people we live in Jordan , we know all too well how things are. The report does not flatter Jordanians, it flatters the regime, and for all the wrong reasons. the reports takes away from its credibility when it considers the local gang a success but the Syrian and Egyptian one a failure. Either they all get an F or they all pass. Because honestly looking for differences is like splitting hairs. If the report was fair to Jordanians and acknowledge the role of its educated and politically and socially aware citizens as the driving force behind 90% of the countries positives, few Jordanians would question the report. but the report is pure propaganda and it celebrates the neo-cons handiwork.
from Jordan
said:Kafer as you know there are plenty of smart Syrians and Iraqis and lebanese who excell also outside their countries. Ever wondered why the Jordanians have the chance to reflect at least the basic qualities they have in Jordan while Iraqis, Syrians and Lebanese don't? Oh ye..I forgot.. it is the American-Zionist influence again! or maybe it is because the Jordanian regime does provide the opportunity for its people to shine, again partially as I know tens of good Jordanians who driven away because of frustration but this situation is still better than many other countries. For me, success is relative while for you failure os complete.
Batir, I guess if Syria gets as much US and foreign aid as we do, may be they will have less poor people. the question is how come 1 in 3 Jordanians, and we are hardly 5 million people, is either unemployed or poor? yet we are still not a failed state? Besides, don't forget the Jordanian regime is the only one that willingly abandoned its occupied territories and citizens in those territories to avoid the cost of liberation. That's not a moral and political failure? have you heard of a regime that ditches its own land, then fights the resistance?
from Jordan
said:Karibou, are you really serious? Jordan abandoned its citiozens and land? For Crying out laoud, wasn't the PLO which stated that it wanted an end of the Jordanian occupation and that each palestinian in Jordan is a Palestinian citizen and not Jordanian?
Wow, you really amaze me!!
"while Iraqis, Syrians and Lebanese don't? Oh ye..I forgot.. it is the American-Zionist "
what do you call over 130,000 invasion tropps in Iraq? conspiracy theory? you are just hopeless Batir.
Was there a referendum? NO! don't use the PLO as an excuse. The PLO was militarily destroyed by the late King. How could a militarily destroyed PLO force the King to ditch his territory? So if the PLO was the powerful how come the King still wants control over Al-Aqsa and other holy sites in Jerusalem? Where is the PLO's influnce on this issue?
So no referendum, and the PLO was destroyed by the king so it can't get in the way of anything, but still wants Jerusalem holy sites. What does that tell us? he ditched the land because he did not want to pay the price of winning it back .
from Jordan
said:"he ditched the land because he did not want to pay the price of winning it back ". If that was the case, then I would go again to his grave and thank him for doing the right job. Jordanians have always been considered "traitors" whenever they got involved with the Palestinian issue and the disengagement was the best act of politics ever done by the late King Hussein and I thank him so much for that.
from Jordan
said:My dear friend Karibou try to get some memory pills. Iraqis were well in poverty and under repression when Saddam was ruling them and getting all the wealth to himself and then the Americans came and completed the mission. The way you say it gives an idea to a creature from Mars that Iraqis were living in the Baath paradise. As for the Syrians you cannot deny the other paradise of Baath since 1970.
"Jordanians have always been considered "traitors" whenever they got involved with the Palestinian "
Batir, Jordanians are one thing. King is another thing. don't you forget that. There were Jordanians for 5000 years. The kingdom and you are less than a 100 years.
Second, never forget that when you thought the PLO was having the upper hand, you were buddies with them. Bus soon as winds of change turned against them, you switched loyalties.
But to comment on your comment. Many East bankers share the same views of west bankers about the role of the king vis a vis the Zionists. but we don't see the king ditching the east bank. how come?
Then what about AL-Aqsa? you never answered that? If king wants to drop west bank, why hold on to AL-Aqsa? there is more claims for the Hashmites over Mecca than Al-Aqsa? what gives?
"Iraqis were well in poverty and under repression when Saddam was ruling them"
unbelievable Batir. Unbelievable. Iraq, according to UN annual reports, before the US siege, had one of the lowest infant mortality rates, best health care and educational system. As a matter of fact, Iraq was inching closer to developed world status and was on par with East European human development statistics.
You are unbelievable!
from Jordan
said:Karibou (KoKo, whatever); regarding Al Aqsa King Husseinn did well to try to keep the Islamic identity of the city while Hamas and fateh were fighting whether to have a one state or two state solution and now ended up with no state at all. King Abdullah is not interested in keeping the hold on Aqsa and now you cosnider him to be not passionate towards Palestine. So, for God sake make up your mind about the Hashemite role in Palestine.
Throughout history, states changed and people are more rooted in history and this is the case of Jordan. The Kingdom which is 100 years has done great and I am proud of it. Even if it was 30 years I will always be proud.
"never forget that when you thought the PLO was having the upper hand, you were buddies with them. Bus soon as winds of change turned against them, you switched loyalties.". Excuse me, are you talking to me?
from Jordan
said:"Iraq was inching closer to developed world status and was on par with East European human development statistics.?. Well, it is always good to have oil and water and fertile soil for development. With its resources Iraq should have been like Western Europe.
However,then the all mighty Saddam adored by most Arabs decided to wage war against Iran for the sake of the USA and then invaded Kuwait and destroyed the livelihoods of generations of innocent Iraqis. I am amzed how this impressive CV is considered a success in the Arab World. The point is, the Hashemire regime in Jordan was far more responsible towards the well being of the people and state than any nationalist Arab regime especially Iraq.
from Jordan
said:I see it as a fair result, I have to agree with most of it :) and i like your posts Batir
"the Hashemire regime in Jordan was far more responsible towards the well being of the people and state than any nationalist Arab regime especially Iraq."
Batir, I don't call Black September responsible. Lets not go there.
But the fact Jordan is not a total failure is a testimony to the resilience of Jordanians, and above all their incredible tolerance for pain, which spared Jordan the instability we see in many of the neighboring countries. Next time you see an average Jordanian, kiss his hand and salute him and say THANK YOU SEEDEE FOR BEING THE CROWN ON MY HEAD. Never EVER forget that Jordan and Jordanians had the potential to turn this wonderful country of ours into the Star of Asia. But God has his reasons and we were cursed with a regime far too incompetent, and far too corrupt for our own dreams and aspirations for our beloved Jordan. And all we have to celebrate is a report by neo-con pseudo-journal telling us our regime is so cool, even as the facts on the ground show a far different story.
from Jordan
said:Fish, let us not go to Black September, you will never stand what I may say.
Any simple mind will know that success needs a conducive environment. Syrians and Iraqis are also intelligent but they could not realize their potential despite the huge resources. Any dynamic population will prove itself within the conditions developed by the governance system, and you can see we are a relative success in Jordan.
I have to say I am really fed up with this flow of anonymous comments. This is the bad side of blogging and internet expressions.
from United Arab Emirates
said:Batir,
I will go to Black Spetmebr, the september whan an army bombed its own civilians, and murdred hundreds if not thousands of innocent JORDANIANS, get your head out your hole. History gets written by the victor, but thank God there are indpenedant sources.
from United Arab Emirates
said:btw the hell with the PLO , they were Gangsters and murderes in their own way as well, but after all they are gangsters, not a government.
"Syrians and Iraqis are also intelligent but they could not realize their potential despite the huge resources."
Batir, any simple mind would know that the whole issue of the discussion is to refuse the assertion the Jordanian regime is any better or worse than the Syrian and Iraqi regimes. Thank you for making my point. All repressive, all self-congratulating, all committed massacres for various reasons, all deny responsibility, all sucked their country's resources dry and destroyed their economies preferring to buy loyalties and enjoy lavish lifestyles for their clans, while their people rot. All claim to be truly democratic, despite the obvious scams that deny their people even a semblance of a working fair democracy. And you as a regime hired pen has ben trying to convince us your benefactors are better for reasons that only you and those who are direct financial beneficiaries seem to agree with. Your key role on the Jordanian blogosphere is to disseminate pure propaganda about how wonderful our regime is and how lucky we are because some mediocre source thinks so. Sounds to me like vintage 1970s eastern block propaganda finally coming to Jordan.
from United States
said:jordan will always be first in spite of you all hate mongers. the only thing that unite you is hate to jordan. kafer, jordanian are not a failed people true,but you are.urdnihur living in the us and criticzing jordan for receiving us aid, that's a big joke.
from United States
said:alwan, what fateh al-eslam is doing in lebanon today is nothing compared to what those mushroomed organizations where doing in jordan back then. each one had it's own army.
from United States
said: On July, 04, 2007 7:53 AM , zaid matela
from United States said:
"urdnihur living in the us and critiquing Jordan for receiving us aid, that's a big joke. "
First,,what living in the US has to do with me criticizing Jordan,even from a country that that I reside in.
Second,,the reason I cited the source ,is to show that Jordan is completely dependent on US aid and can't survive on it's own ,as Batire was trying to convince you that Jordan is a "viable" State. Third,,Aids from the US is attached with conditions and obligation that Jordan has to follow.
fourth,Jordan can't be a viable State as long as ,Jordan keeps adhering to US demands and condition ,in political science jargon ,it's called client or proxy State
from Jordan
said:Al Urduni as you always love to interrogate others and state your opinions I would like to ask you why do you live in the USA and I will be interested to know about your political belief system. You know, for me you are still nothing but a ghost behind a keyboard claiming to have the ultimate wisdom.
from United States
said:,"You know, for me you are still nothing but a ghost behind a keyboard claiming to have the ultimate wisdom."
batir,,I must say this to you ,you made me laugh when I read your comments,
First ,,keyboards are the medium of communication between me and you,don't agree on that ,Batair and isn't true,that you have blog to communicate with outside world such as people like me, Batir??or you want people to except your argument at a face value without rigorous debate and test??
Don't you think your blog will be so boring without people like me who always trying to challenge you and give a different perspective ??,
I don't think you want people who always agree with you,Batir,that would be so bland and boring at the same time,don't you think?
On my political beliefs,,well I probably told you some of it already ,I don't believe in any religion ,and I believe they are like hashish or opium to control the masses and make them terrified of the unknown.
On the question of why I have migrated to US ,I left Jordan for several reason ,A,when I graduated from High school in 1977 with grade average of B,I wasnt able to join the the university of Jordan because I didn't have wasta in the government,so I had no choice but to leave Jordan and seek a different life and depend on my self to become productive human being. B,,I don't think its your business to know Why I migrated.
from Jordan
said:Al Urduni, Fantastic, I managed to provoke you to get some answers. It seems it did not cross your mind that I wanted to have a personal communication with you apart from the continuous retaliation we always have. I got a very important piece of info which is the fact that you graduated from high school when I was 8 years old which means that I have to respect you and communicate with you on the basis that you are older and deserve the respect. I think I have the right to know something about the personality of people who make my blog exciting and save it from boredom.
Thanks for the insight, I appreciate it.
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from Italy
Jordan isn't surely the worst State in the world and neither in Islamic world.
I probably will come there for holiday with my parents: I really hope so! :-)