By "using Solidere as a template" were they referring to the way the actual product itself is gonna look like at the end or to how they were going to secure property in the downtown area?

Because I remember being told that Solidere managed to secure all that property by not only buying properties from owners, but also by giving them shared in the company itself so that they benefitted from the company's success in the project and became part owners.

Is there an actual company that's going to do the project or is it going to be GAM itself?

On August, 20, 2006 9:27 AM , Summer
from United States said:

it seems like a great idea but to tell you the truth i do not think it will work out as good as it is working out in Beirut. because as you said, of the cultural and civil differences between the Jordanians and the Lebanese....I just cannot imagine it happening........men , women and families walking down the streets in the intended areas safely from the eyes of the young men acting in a civil way towards the young women without harassment? I really do not see it happening.
I guess the religious people in Jordan will condemn such place considering it a place of sin, that calls for immoral and unethical behavior...I am sure it will be a hot topic to be discussed during the Friday speeches and prayers..it will be condemned and attacked strongly. If the same laid back, casual, relaxed and free spirited scenes that you see in Beirut are going to be duplicated in Amman, you are wrong..it will take Jordanians more open minds and more acceptance of personal freedom to be in such place. Not in anyway I am implying that people in Jordan are not civil at all, just they have a different value system and way of thinking, I see it as a more conservative way of thinking and conservative way of acting in public places....I am not talking about YOU or people who have experienced living abroad or others with broad idea about the outside world...because I am very sure that most Jordanians act very civil within their own environments or even abroad. And I mean this in a good way.
But I should quote you on this:
“I have to say that I feel excited about the theoretical idea of downtown Amman becoming a place for pedestrian activities and entertainment with both sexes of the human species interacting in one place in an open and civilized way, but I fear this is just a dream.” YES...it is just a DREAM!!

By "using Solidere as a template", does the template include the $40 billion debt? Or is that complimentary?

On August, 20, 2006 10:10 AM , mala2e6
from Jordan said:

well,I think that Alwakalat experiance(closing the streets and prohibiting the cars from parking there and only allowing pedestrians)is somehow similiar to the solidere in concept.solidere is an area for shopping(very expensive)and for having some fun,dinning,argeeleh and lots of activities going on the Biel near solidere.
now since Alwakalt is located in west amman,we can see it is somehow going OK,the staring youth are there,we cannot deny their presence.
now having a smiliar experiance downtown wont be as successful as the solidere or Alwakalt experiance due to location.

in west Amman youth are accustomed to interact with each other,there are mixed schools there,many many coffee shops that they use to hang out.downtown Amman...I wonder what will happen

just a reminder

when amman amphitheatre started organizinging some events,many unfortunate incidents took place there,many harasssments(just ask about kazem alsaher and Sarah Brightman musical and you get an idea what will happen there

a disaster

On August, 20, 2006 10:39 AM , dozz
from Jordan said:

architecturally...no
please noo...B(
it just doesnt fit.

On August, 20, 2006 11:31 AM , Firas
from Jordan said:

Can you please please please invest money in fixing our public schools?

Yes public schools, so after 20 or 30 years, you could start thinking about having such projects, without having some male things wandering around and harassing poeple!

Fix school first! Needless to say I smell another governmental project that the only benefits go into the pockets of those in power!

Fix schools to teach people it's rude to stare, litter garbage, taking care of personal hygiene, etc!

I think u r right..I have studied in Amman and stayed their for 8 years..its a lovely clean city (cleaner than Damascus ) but people are exactly the way you described them. In Damas, girls get vebal (talteesh) but not the same way as Amman(the style is so defernet)

LOL @ harami. No the $40 billion debt comes as a complimentary snack to the load of more serious problems, namely, the Hariri Inc. and all the dirt they bring

On August, 20, 2006 10:57 PM , Hasan
from United States said:

As Firas said.

On August, 21, 2006 5:50 PM , The Observer
from Jordan said:

Wow! It seems to me to be a great idea. The downtown area is so beautiful where it can be re-inovated and become a really nice place for pedestrians.

I understand all of your fears about young guys harrassments of women, but maybe something like the social police huts that they started in Amman would help in this case.

Downtown area isn't like before. It is now more of a place for Egyptian poor workers who mind their own business rather than those young zo3ran guys.

I feel that our society is changing in a matter that we havent realize yet. In the past couple of years with the Satellite Tv stations, the internet and mobile phones, both sexes got exposed to each other like never before. Harrassing women in streets isn't those young guys only outlet now. They have other means of contact with opposite sex.

Maybe it can work. I don't want to see just Caffes, I want to see bars and night clubs in the downtown. It would become an appealing toursitic area, and would generate much money.

On August, 21, 2006 10:46 PM , geoff
from United States said:

I wonder why Jordanians do not question "who is who" in such huge projects! Why they don't care when King Abdullah runs Jordan as a farm and milks his people all the way!!

Such Arab cows..:-)

On August, 22, 2006 3:48 AM , Hasan
from United States said:

"I don't want to see just Caffes, I want to see bars and night clubs in the downtown. It would become an appealing toursitic area, and would generate much money."

Unfortunately, it's this mentality that is as shallow as it gets that has no regard or sensitivity to the impact "generating much money" would have on an economy where not everyone has access to that money.

If Jordan cannot stand on its own feet when sober, how do you think we will manage when our streets are lined with bars and clubs?

People in the dark ages drank alcohol. Many credit the coffee shops in Vienna as triggers to the enlightenment era of thought and contemplation. It is true that coffee shops in Amman are not used for "intellectual" thought, but at least you can think straight instead of being piss faced.

If the goal is generating money, then why don't we legalize prostitution and drugs? Oh wait, those are considered immoral in America (example of a successful economy.) But whose moral standards do we follow?

مش امشيه معانا او احنا صاحيين, بدك اتسكرنا كمان؟

On August, 22, 2006 8:24 AM , The Observer
from Jordan said:

Well ya Hasan, anyone who wants to get drunk can just do that. We have plenty of bars in Jordan. This isn't an issue. Even in Saudia Arabia that forbides dealing with Alcohol, you can see people trade it in secrecy, and many get drunk when they want.

Besides, going to a bar doesnt mean you are going to get drunk! Most people know how to drink moderately.

While prostitution and drugs is an entirely different subject, but you can have an example set in Holland. It might not be as bad as you think it is.

Why not having a Casino as well? :)

Man, we can be the lung for our brothers in the gulf to breath! They don't have to go to Europe to spend their money, they can do all of that here, and all of the Jordanians can benefit from it!

On August, 22, 2006 8:28 AM , The Observer
from Jordan said:

geoff, King Abdullak milks us? lol

How in the Hell can you say that? Just look at the improvement happened in the economy of Jordan in the past couple of years since he started his role as a King despite the mess that is going on in our region!

There are many official statistics that shows how much we progressed. And yes, a smart leadership is the key to our progress...

The Observer, your reasoning is pretty shallow. You dont seem to understand economics very well my friend.

On August, 25, 2006 12:02 PM , The Observer
from Jordan said:

Observer kaman?!
Have I really showed what I understand of economics in the few lines above?

Anyway, I am not an economic expert, but I can read, think, and give an opionion.

On September, 16, 2006 4:13 AM , Omar
from United States said:

Such an interesting article..Downtown Amman has obsolutely the need to be reshaped and rebuilt again regardless of the way is it going to be. One important thing like the writer said in his article is to preserve its beauty. I never realized that the coexistance of both sexes in my country Jordan is a problem, not even in dowtown elghor- with all respect to residents of that region-not Amman!!Simply because people are already mixed there. You don't see men on one side and women on the other for example. l'm not asking to have strip clubs over there, but l'm asking to remodel that part of the city and create some entertaining places so places can have fun there. All people from different social classes. I think it's a relatively big area and we can do that. Another important thing, we cannot just sit and let some people- they could be many- like the youth mentioned to change our plans for the future and be an obstacle for improving our country. We should make a change, and they need to be changed. And YES we could, it might take a long time but it's possible.

On February, 22, 2007 10:00 PM , shams
from Jordan said:

I am hoping someone who really knows the details will answer me. When we say the downtown do we actually mean the street on which the ancient Jame3 il Husseini is located and the buildings along the same side of the street and opposite the mosque along ancient ones like the Souq Al Boukhariyyeh ( built in 1946-48)? Dont they qualify as heritage or monuments?

Are the investors to deal directly with the owners of the shops along all that long street or is the municipality going to make it cheaper fot them to invest at the expense of the owners by actually appropriating the buildings"for the public good" or such other claim and then let the investors alone reap huge profits with some of that going illicitely to whoever makes it easier and cheaper for investors to carry on with the project and reap humongous profits. Bater ...do u know? anyone else? maybe someone from the municipality itself?
Another thing is: whatever happened to that Japanese grant to Jordan that was allocated for turning that street into a pedestrian street? where is that money?

Are we only talking renovation or totally new buildings?
what about the people who live off those little souks at rents that can only make u laugh !What about the law/3ourf that has over 50 years and more turned renters into owners as u cannot get rid of a renter unless u pay him hundreds of thousands in key money(khlouw)? not to mention the law that may or may not be approved by parliament regarding owners and renters supposedly to pass in 2010 that may change that and for once allow owners to raise rents and no khlow or key money hence allowing owners to earn a half way decent rent?
How will property be evaluated in case of istimlak(the cheap way of securing the land for investors) or of shares in the new project should istimlak not be the option?
I wish Mayor would see this post. I am more than ready to explain the problems that may arise and also the injustice